Hello:


I am new to your forum. I am actually not a single parent, although I (29) am involved with a single mother (41). If it is not appropriate for me to post on this forum, accept my apologies. I have the utmost respect for single parents, and my intent is not to take attention away from such.

I have been seeing this woman for over two years now. We met at work, and have had a serious relationship since that point. I was introduced to her son (11) at the office one day, and since then, had some sort of rapport with him. Since very early on, she seemed to trust him with me. I took him to some sporting events, etc., and occasionaly, I'd send stuff home to him. but that was about it. Throughout this whole time, he knows nothing other than his mother and I are "friends".

We had a rough time shortly thereafter, and she began to pull away. We kept in touch, and although very stressful, we eventually moved past some issues, and she thought it was a good time to include me in her home life. I accepted.

Conviniently, her son was having difficulty at school, so I came in as a tutor of sorts. Although I was there for more than just that, it seemed like a good way to ease into things, and see how he'd react. Prior to this, he'd call me to take him places, go play basketball, or just rent a movie. As the months went by, I got a real taste as to what she went through at home. He is very difficult with her, and gives her a hard time about the simplest of things (i.e. showering, eating, etc.). To be honest, she has spoiled him, as working so hard, she seldom has the energy nor the desire to argue with him on every little issue, so it's fair to say that he runs the show through sheer tenacity.

Nevertheless, our relationship was going well, although we did have our rough patches whenever he decided he didn't want to study. Seeme that things only got better. I began to have dinner there, and he would oiften mention how it seemed that I was part of the family. It basically seemed as though we were playing house. I do have to mention that her mother does live there, and things are not as cozy as they sound.

Once the semester ended, we thought we'd have a bit of a break from the stress the school year had brought. Think Again!! Since he had not done so well in grammar and literature, we thought that getting him into summer reading would be helpful. Well, he did not share the sentiment. He has been making scenes ever since. He had always been somewhat lazy and defiant, but he has reached an all time high. To make matters worse, it seems that he doesn't appreciate my role as part of the "school enforcers". He has changed with me. To the point that I discussed it with his mother, and we agreed that I wouldn't come by for a while so he'd learn that there are consequences to his misbehavior.

The reason I've mentioned all of this is simply to ask, "what is my role in all of this?" I realize she has a VERY stressful life. He alone is not easy to handle. But often, I would do the dirty work, and study, go over homework, and all of that. She has tried very hard to include me in decisions, mainly when it comes to him, so I do believe the effort is there.

But again, here I am at home now. Letting him run the show yet again. But what is the other option? To be his doormat, and only be appreciated when it's to buy him something or take him somewhere? I know he's 13, and that in itself is trouble, but I cannot discipline him....ultimately, he is not mine. But his mother, has allowed him to dictate terms of all sorts of things for years, She and I seem to be having arguments over all sorts of things now. I have asked her if maybe he like me as his playmate, but doesn't appreciate the attention I get from her. His father is worthless, and has never come around, except for the occasional guilt visit, when he has had the audacity to ask his son for money. He's a real winner. And I understand the boy has issues with his father. So I try to be there for him no matter how bad he treats me sometimes. I feel as though he should know that there is someone who does care about him although he doesn't have to. But in the meantime, it seems as though I have lost his respect. Not that he treats his own mother that much better, but how much is too much to take?

I personally believe she is creating a monster by allowing him to be such a brat. And remember, the most he knows is that we talk on the phone. He knows nothing about a relationship, nor has he seen any evidence of one. So god only knows what would happen if that came out. Up until recently, she even wanted us all to go on vacation together.

I'm in a very tough spot because I don't like for him to be acting that way, and sometimes I just want to put him in his place, but I know I can't. I love both of them, but it seems that things keep getting worse, and I'm even beginning to resent her sometimes for allowing him to always get his way. His behavior has ruined many a night, for the little time we do spend alone. She claims to understand that she has made him this way, but still continues to allow it to happen. What now?

Sorry for the long read....but any advice would be appreciated!!

Hi DarkKnight,
Nice to meet you. I think it is fine for you to post here. This is ultimately a single parent family issue. It's good for us as well to hear from someone in your position.
You seem to be in a rough spot. Sorry for that.
You ask us an open question What is your role?
I think you should ask the mother.
Two years into a relationship, you must be asking where is this going. Will it always be this way.
You are right she most likely does live a very stressful life, but so are you, and very limited.

Ultimately she is the parent and always will be. He is her child to raise and disipline. They are both super lucky to have such a giving individual as yourself to help supportively.
It really sounds like you care and want to be part of their lives.
Perhaps it is time for a real big honest talk with her.
Just how involved are you going to get.
The child is hitting his teens. whoa rough period at best, even with the most balances of kids. She probally will make many choices in regards to raising him that you don't agree with. But she is listening to you right and then she makes her choices. Thing is, you are the boyfriend, and no matter how fabulous the two of you may be together in many ways there will always be a line of how much your input will affect her and the way she choices to raise and handle him.
I think you and your girlfriend are kidding yourselves if you think he is unaware. Kids are more atuned than we give them credit for.
She needs to tell you exactly how much she is willing to hear from you on this and you need to decide if you are willing to accept that posistion.

I wish you luck and a great happy ending.
Harmony

Welcome aboard DarkKnight,

Sorry to hear you're in such a rough spot. I do commend your efforts and empathy in all this. You really seem like a very caring individual. You're always welcomed here.



What is your role? Your role's whatever the mother allows you to play. She knows what's best, regardless. However, you're the adult here whether you're a friend, a step-parent or a neighbour. You're the adult and he is the child. Don't allow him to disrespect you. This definately should be addressed with this child. He may tell you off but if you continually remind him of YOUR expectations of him, he'll respect you for it. I don't feel it's necessary to allow this boy to step all over you because you're not blood related. As a single mother myself, I would HOPE that my bf would be forward enough to outline his boundaries with my son. You don't have to be mean about it but directive.

Also, pulling away at a time where this boy may need you is not teaching him appropriate consequences. Again, he's running the show. If he doesn't like what you have to offer, he knows all he has to do is act out and then you'll pull away. Careful with this. It's going to do more damage than any good in the long run.

Again, I would clearly outline your expectations of him. If he crosses that line then his consequences may be WHAT you do together. Maybe the fun activities; the treats; the movies could be put on hold for a little while? I wouldn't abandon the child, even for a short while. I think his dad has done that already.

Maybe he's realizing your role. He's old enough to understand. Playing the educational role had taught him that your NOT just some buddy to hang out with and have fun. You're another authority in his life he has to listen to. He doesn't like that does he? So should you pull away so he doesn't have to listen to you anymore? There's a valuable lesson in this and here's your shot to teach him what's right - permitting that the mother agrees.

What am I asking you? If you choose to be a part of this child's life then you have to go about it the respecful way. You don't need the mother's permission in this. However, how she disciplines HER child is none of your concern. You may wish to guide her with alternative ideas - objectively but don't be stepping on her toes.

Has this boy undergone any therapy? You say the father is a loser. Has anybody discussed this with him in how he feels about it? Also, he retaliated when you enrolled him into summer school for grammar and literature, do you think maybe he has some form of learning disability? Summer school isn't always the best solution if he isn't provided with the additional support to modify the work for him. I've worked with children who are very bright but find it extremely difficult to transfer thoughts onto paper. Sometimes you can even test it simply by how they hold their pencils. Just a thought. (I've got more info on this if you'd like)

Reality alert: If his mother isn't consistent with him and is allowing him to run the household, it's really difficult to fix what's already broken. Maybe she could use some parenting counselling to help her with techniques in dealing with a pre-teen.

Question: What do YOU want out of this? What's your long term goal in this relationship? Do they match up with hers?

Hope we've helped even just a little. Hang in there!

Well, I'll start by saying thanks for the kind words, and for taking the time to respond.

I definitely was pushing for therapy since last September, once I realized how bad the situation had become. Although I don't believe therapy can work miracles, I did think it would be good for some sort of impartial individual to hear all sides, and at very least mediate the altercations between mother and son. She has so much guilt for not being able to give her son the "perfect family", that she often goes overboard to compensate, and constantly feels as though nothing she does is enough. She does not have it easy at all. Finally, once the school year did end, she started taking him to a therapist. And yes, after 13 years, she finally told her son about why his father is the way he is.

Over the course of the last month, we have had him evaluated academically, and have explored the possibility of dyslexia. He is current scheduled to undergo a neurological evaluation next week. We are exploring all possibilities, although much of his problem stems from laziness and a lack of self confidence. Hopefully, the therapy can help there too. He seems to have a problem trying at anything. He gives up too easily. That's why even I attempted to overcompensate and let things slide....I now see that was not such a good idea.

As for me, what I want is clarity. I've never been an insecure person, but the more convoluted the situation becomes, the more insecure I get. Sometimes it seems as though they can't live without me, and other days, it seems as though I don't matter. And while I was once a 13 year old boy, I don't expect it from a 41 year old woman. I realize she has plenty on her plate, but I do help out, and all I really want is some consistency, and consideration.

I don't get involved in her disciplining of the boy, and I would never undermine her in front of him, but we have had arguments because although she agrees she is spoiling him, she continues to do it. If she were just my friend, we'd be having the same argument. I don't really know how to give any sort of advice but the blunt type. Now, the day she tells me to keep my opinion to myself, I simply will. That in itself will speak volumes.

As for long term goals, who can have any when the reality is that we don't know what I am getting into. Without the child knowing anything, we can't make plans for much further than next week. What if he likes me as a playmate for him, but dislikes the idea of his mother with anyone? Who knows? Obviously, in this situation, what he thinks could very easily make or break the relationship I have with her as well. It's impossible to make plans when only two of the three people involved know. I�m not too thrilled at the fact that a 13 year old can dictate the terms of my relationship, but that is what is happening. And furthermore, I don't want to be forced down someone's throat. If he doesn�t like me, or the idea of any man coming into the house, I will have to respect that. He�s got enough problems as it is, and clearly, me being good to him just isn�t enough.

What I do know, is that much like the situation has changed, so have the dynamics of our relationship. She just expects me to understand without so much as an explanation. Sometimes I feel as though she has been single way too long, and really doesn�t know what it is like to care for someone other than her son. She used to be different, but maybe all good things must come to an end.

I�m really not happy being a light switch. I think I�m just convenient to have around for both of them. The other day he called to �apologize� for the way he had treated me, and I thought we were making progress�.right up until the point that he mentions his PS2 is not connecting to the internet correctly, and wants me to come over and fix it. I know he�s just a kid, but that actually hurt me. The sad thing is, sometimes she isn�t all that much different either. I only seem to matter when it�s convenient. Who knows anymore? I�m just thoroughly disappointed and confused.

Thanks for listening.

Hi DK. I am pushed for time and have not read all the posts, so what I say may be redundant.
First thing is first. Does she want a permanent relationship with you? You need a definitive answer on that before you make any other decision.
If the answer is no, then move on, you have been a toy.
If the answer is yes, then you need to establish some ground rules. First, it seems that her son desperately needs a father figure. That being said, you must have the authority to be a disciplinarian. Whatever you do must be backed up fully by his mom, or it won't be effective. It doesn't sound like your the type of guy that would hit him, so obviously we don't need to go there.
Second, taking away the father figure (you) is a horrible form of punishment. Obviously that is what he is reaching for in the first place. That is a predicament all of us here face. In addition, it removes you from the very thing you are trying to build.
I am curious if your girlfriend wants you or a role model for her son. Before I had Katie, I dated a single mom too. I finally figured out that she was with me because I was good for her son. I still miss the boy, but I had to leave her. If you don't feel loved, you will be miserable. Trust me.
I would discuss it with her. If she wants you, she will back you up with her son. You'll just have to find common ground on the discipline.

I have four words for ya. "eleven year old boy" my son is 13 and althought it hasn't been that bad, there were some times and issues. It has a lot to do with how he was with his real dad and thinking he is being replaced in his moms life by you. I also agree with K'sDaddy, a good sit down heart to heart with the three of you may tend to help.

I need to say that you have to stop thinking of the child's behavior as the problem and focus in on the mother. The obvious is that she has an 11 year old child who is going through some different stages but your role seems to be step in when it is convienent to her and that is not fair to you. I know the feeling because I dated a woman who had a child and I felt the same way, I was never given any clue on what I was expected and I did ask many times. This was before I had children myself.

She needs to be open and honest with you in what she expects from you. Not just that but she needs to clarify that if you are not going to play an active role in her child's life, what does that mean for the 2 of you. Does she consider you a fling on the side after all these years or does she really have the feelings for you that you have for her and her son?

See, it sounds like to me that she isn't giving you the whole story. She wants a man around some of the time but then again she doesn't. It sounds like she lets her son run the show as an excuse not to get attached to another man. MAybe she is scared and that is the hidden issue behind all this. You really should talk to her not just about her son, but where the two of you stand. I could be wrong but going through a similar experience there might be a chance that she is not admitting her fear or reluctance is caused by something other then her son.

Point of clarification: The child is now 13, he was 11 when we were introduced.


I thank you all for your input, as you all do make valid points. I certainly agree, that the child's behavior is not the only issue. It may certainly not be the biggest one as well.

I suppose that maybe some people get so "beat up" by life, that they just don't/can't feel what they used to anymore. I know her past experiences haven't been anything to write home about. I'm also aware that sometimes she tries, but who knows really? Certainly, fear of real intimacy has played a huge role in our relationship, or lack thereof. She wants us all to do things together, hang out at the house, go on vacation, but somehow, you just can't help feeling as though it is more for him than for her. I believe that she has given up on a "fantasy", and settled for a good person. I doubt she's been looking for a "love of her life" or "soulmate". At this point, I really don't think she was looking for anything. I just know we got along very well. There was something very special there, as I was the one on the receiving end of the attention back then.

Who really knows what goes on in the mind of another.

***Question*** The father and child have not lived together since he was 3. The man has literally not done anything for the boy since then. A couple of phone calls a year with sorry excuses is about the limit. So why is the boy so bent on "hero worship", when it comes to him, and so quick to mistreat his own mother, who has given him the world? For that matter, I doubt I'll ever mean very much in the grand scheme, and I too have already done more for him than his own dad. Anyone have experience with this?

Some people heal faster then others, some differently then others, some never at all.

The only person who knows is her. If she is leading you one she may not even know it, she may not even realize it because she may not know what she wants. I know a lot of women like that. Then again she may know what she wants and knows if she tells you that you may leave, the temporary person to fill the void of loniness she feels when she feels it, then when it is filled she wants to be alone until it comes back. I don't know, like I said only she would truely know.

Glenn

Wow, what a thread. This is like reading the transcript of my last relationship only from the other perspective. I was the single mom with the special needs boy. I can understand how you feel I just hope you are as verbal to your GF as you are on here. My ex bf I'm sure felt exactly the way you do but was never able to communicate it until after we were seperated. We were on and off for five years living together for the first three. After some begging he did see a therapist with me, but would not accept that he needed to change some of his approaches as well. It was all just my fault. I don't presume to know this child or what his motives are but be sure to not make judgements too hasty with him. Children are much more complex than people give them credit for. Boy I could tell you stories that would blow your mind.
I think first you need to decide what it is that you want. How much do you love them, because if it is anything like what I went through you have to have a lot of love. Second talk with the mom and find a good counselor for both of you. I would leave the boy out of it at first. The adults have to be on the same page before you try and include the boy. My ex was a very nice guy and really wanted to do the right thing but he was unable to make any compromises and could not see things from my perspective only his own.
You sound like a very nice reasonable person, and that fact that you are on here shows that you could have the dedication and understanding to make this work if you really want to. I cannot believe how closely this all hits home for me.
Good luck,
Heidi

Well, luckily or not, depending on how one sees it, things were discussed. Sadly, it was prompted by an episode, where the boy decided to erase the calls on her phone, and consequently mine. The mother was unable to join me at a family gathering as a result.

Nevertheless, I made mention of how if I had gone over there today, I would've let him know that what he had done was not right (since it had already happened earlier in the week). She then proceeded to tell me that she wouldn't feel comfortable watching me discipline her son. Finally, some truth!!!

I then proceeded to let her know that if I was good enough to help the boy with homework, take him out, and buy him things, I should be able to let him know when he's done something wrong and discipline him (I'm not sure what that would entail, but it wouldn't be physical...I just refuse to do that). Well, as it turns out, even that is a problem for her.

I don't think I am out of line, and told her that I will not sit by and be his punching bag. Feels like I was used this whole time. Nevertheless, it seems that things are going downhill from here. Just thought I'd update, as all of you have been very helpful.

Sorry things are deteriorating.

I understand the desire to not let his behaviour go uncorrected.
Did the mom discipline or discuss the incident with him in anyway?
I scanned back through quickly, I may have missed the answer to this question. Sorry if that is the case.
Did you ever have that conversation as to what she saw your role to be now and in the future?

I am a single mom and have been for a while. I am not in a relationship, but I am fairly confident that if I were I would not want the person I was involved with to be taking on a disciplinarian role with my son.
However, I do know that I would be on it myself.

I'm sorry to hear that but better to have it all out so you know where you stand. I have a bit of a different feeling than harmony on this. I also have been a single mom for many years. While I completely understand not feeling comfortable letting someone else discipline I figure heck why not let someone else share the role of "bad guy" for a change.

Really though, if I were just casually dating someone I would want them to be very limited in what they had to say to him in the way of reprimand. If I were in a serious relationship the goal for me would be marriage. In that case I would want them to take on the role of parent as much as possible which of course includes discipline. I think if you don't allow them to feel comfortable to do that they will never feel completely comfortable in the role of parent and the kids can sense that and use it against them. The biggest hurdle to overcome is agreeing on techniques and trusting eachother in how they handle it.

I hate to say it but if she isn't willing to let go a bit and trust you to handle things with him the relationship will always be strained. You will always be questioning what your role is.
As a single mom I applaud you for the efforts you took to seek help with this it really shows how commited you were to the relationship. Hopefully she will see that before it is too late.

quote:

Originally posted by DarkKnight:
[qb]
She then proceeded to tell me that she wouldn't feel comfortable watching me discipline her son.

I then proceeded to let her know that if I was good enough to help the boy with homework, take him out, and buy him things, I should be able to let him know when he's done something wrong and discipline him

I will not sit by and be his punching bag. Feels like I was used this whole time. [/qb]

Well where does she see your role in this relationship? How does she see your future together? I agree with you. I wouldn't allow this boy to use you as his punching bag. As far as taking on the role of disciplinary, I guess that would all depend if you were the primary adult involved in whatever the issue was. I don't think you'd have to be a parent to do that.

So besides the fact that you 'love her' why else are you still in this relationship? If you don't know .. well love is never enough. Maybe you ARE wasting your time here with her.