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Old 10-07-2009, 07:25 PM   #1
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Default AGH, I have had it

I am sitting here waiting for my daughter to get home and I am not looking forward to it.

So, idig, you will appreciate this---the first week of school went fantastic. The second one was a bit harder. The third one, A said she did not feel well. Tummy stuff was going around so I let her stay home but I went to work. Later I found out she was just fine. Last week, Tuesday she did not want to go to school, threw a big fit. Wed, and Thursday, same things. We were late one of those days, and I told her this was her one get out of jail free card and I would go in and excuse it.

Yesterday morning she tried to not go to school. Then she called my mom and said she was sick. My mom told her to tough it out. This morning she WOULD NOT get up. I had to drag her physically out of bed and dress her like a two year old. I got kicked and hit for my effort. On top of that, on the way to school, she opened her car door and tried jumping out at a stop light. We were 20 minutes late. I went inside with her and I think she thought I was going to excuse her again. Instead, I told A to tell them why we were late. She said nothing. So I said, "She refused to get up and get dressed by herself. As far as I am concerned her tardy is unexcused." She hung her head and started crying and ran off. I felt bad.

Immediately I went to the school counselor who A has met with once and explained my concern. Okay, this child who is talented and gifted identified--who reads and tests out at a post-graduate level in reading and language skills---is getting a D in Reading. She has a C in language skills.

The counselor is going to check in on her. He said that this is normal transition stuff and not to worry. But I am. The disrespect towards me has grown to be almost unmanageable. She won't get up. Things are turning physical. I have to go to work, I can't deal with this every single morning. I am at my wits end. This is so unlike A and I am really out of my mind concerned.

Any thoughts?

---------- Post added at 03:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:08 PM ----------

Round number two: She came home, didn't like that I was going to get McDonald's for her for dinner before dance. So she ran out the door and took off and said she was not coming back. I ended up chasing her in my stocking feet.
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Old 10-07-2009, 07:29 PM   #2
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Lisa it sounds like there is more going on than pre-teen attitude. If the teachers havent noticed anything and she isnt saying anything , does she have a friend that is close with you that you may be able to ask about anything that may be going on?
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Old 10-07-2009, 07:45 PM   #3
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Wow, Lisa that is some serious drama!

I had a little of the running out the door and down the road stuff. I did just what you did, went after her. She was grounded for a while the times she did it. From the phone, or doing things with friends.

I honestly do not know what I would do if my kids had ever hit me or told they hate me. I have never had it happen (knocking frantically on wood again).

Doesn't A have a counselor ya'll go to periodically? Might be time to give her a call.

Did I tell ya'll about the time Mark asked to go, a year or so ago. I thought it was because of his dad. Turned out he wanted the counselor help me see the error of my ways in demanding so much from him Tough things like doing his chores, not trashing the house, go to bed at a reasonable time.... It was comical because I could tell she was trying not to laugh. She did an excellent job of letting him know that I was doing my job without seeming like she was siding with me....
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:13 PM   #4
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

My 3 boys take turns being the slow stubborn ones in the morning so there is always a struggle with someone...but no hitting as yet. The counselor is the obvious first step, but, I do know that around here, hitting would not go unpunished. Whatever the issues are, such behaviour is not tolerated from one brother to another, or, God forbid, they ever direct it toward me.

I will say this, if someone told me they were getting me McD. food I would go running down the street too. Something big is on her mind, and I hope something easily addressed.
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:14 PM   #5
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Wow, Lisa! I am worried too. Seems like something must have happened. Something at school. This behavior is like stuff E would do, but the cause must be something entirely different.
I could guess possibilities all night, but that would be pointless.
Prayers for you and A. I hope she opens up and talks to you about whatever it is that is eating her up.
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

My A did the grade dropping thing too, only in 5th grade for her. Then we fought every night because I kept insisting she show me her work, go over studying. This is the same year I went to the school for help like I posted in the other thread. They clearly said - lay out the consequences and follow through. Do not argue with a preteen/teenager.

I admit though, I never had one flat refuse to get out of bed and get ready for school. I think if it were me I would have let her stay home that day, but then there would be some serious grounding going on, like Motherboard and Blues style. Earning back everything, tv, phone, ipod, radio, all of it...

You'll figure out what works for the two of you! Good luck with it and let us know!
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:15 PM   #7
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

I bet you something is wrong at school and she doesn't wanna be there.

I had a similar problem when I was 13 and tha reason was I was being sexually assaulted and picked on by the boys and the girl who saw it thought I was a slut who was stealing their crushes so they wanted to beat me up. I was so humiliated and scared that I never said anything to my mom. I was also afraid maybe she would blame me for what was happening, so I just made excuses not to go and while I was there I cut class and hid most of the day so my grades were trash.

Maybe try to figure out whats going on and be nice and caring when asking? That may help her open up about whatever the issue is.
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:27 PM   #8
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

So, things have escalated even more. On the way to the dance studio she jumped out again at a traffic stop and ran some ways. I turned around, called the dance studio and told them she was not going to be there. The lady who answered is a friend of mine.

Upon getting home, she ran again. I picked her stuff up and headed for the door. She ran at me and sat in my way, then tried pushing me down the stairs.

Next, I went in the house. She stood in the doorway and would not leave or enter. So, I tricked her and got her off balance, and she feel inside. Then I drug her to her room where she is now screaming, "I hate you, I hate you you evil witch. That is your nickname. I hope you DIE DIE." Nice huh?

The school counselor made things worse I think. He talked to her and she came home hot to trot.
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:43 PM   #9
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Lisa you and A are definately in my prayers tonight. My oldest started getting an attitude around the same time so I made one day a week for just her and I for a few hours. It helped but I believe our issues were new siblings and not enough time related. Plus you seem to do special things with A alot. I wish I could be more help and definately here if there is anything I can do. Maybe when this meltdown is over she will open up!
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Old 10-07-2009, 08:54 PM   #10
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Ok, Lisa, you have good instincts. Is something more happening or is she just testing those boundaries super hard?

---------- Post added at 06:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:45 PM ----------

If you are fairly certain this is a testing thing:

My passive aggressive one pulled some ____ thinking she was gaining independence. We found a friend of a friend who was a family court judge. We took her to the courtroom and sat outside while the judge had a little talk with her. You know any judges or policemen that would do that for you?
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:09 PM   #11
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Wow Lisa, Im sorry I have no advice for you. Im thinking maybe it is an age thing, transition with school, or maybe something did happen. Whatever it is, do you think she might talk to you about it when she calms down a bit?
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:21 PM   #12
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Nana came and got her because she scratched me up. It was nana getting her, or me beating her. Nana is making her sit in her room for the evening without tv and she can't play with the cousins.

I know both the juvenile judges from my work. I am tempted, really tempted to approach one to have a "come to jesus" talk with her. Also, I just found out that you can hand your kid over to juvenile hall for 2 hours and they get to see what it is like in there---complete with talking to some not nice teenage inmates.

Now the problem.....I don't know what it is. She says that I don't care about her. She said that I treat her just the way her dad does [whatever that means]. She said that she hates that I am on this forum--okay that one is funny because most the time when I am talking to you all she is a) at a friends house or b) she is in bed asleep. She said I don't understand her and that I don't care about her. And the list went on........I think she is angry and does not know where to point that anger to. I think I have given her a little too much freedom and when I crack down on things, I get lip. I have really been on her about her attitude lately.

---------- Post added at 05:19 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:17 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Natty View Post
Whatever it is, do you think she might talk to you about it when she calms down a bit?
I think so. And I bet she apologizes too. She came home mad at me for what I did this morning when I told the attendance lady what I did. Things escalated from there. She came home with the attitude that I could not make her do things if she did not want to. She was pushing this, I think to see what would happen.

---------- Post added at 05:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:19 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by idig View Post
Ok, Lisa, you have good instincts. Is something more happening or is she just testing those boundaries super hard?
My instinct is that she is testing these super hard. I think she is stuck between being a child and a teenager. In so many ways intelligence wise, she is smarter than alot of adults I know. However, her emotions are no where close. She is at that age where she is trying to find out where she is in relation to the world, and who she is without me around. She has always been a good kid, challenging but good. I think she has all these hormonal issues that she is out of control with and that they are all just colliding. To tell you the truth, I don't even think she knows why she is doing what she is doing.
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:26 PM   #13
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Just a thought, is there any chance that she can access this forum and read postings?

Does sound like there is something going on in her world.

Sorry life is so tough right now!
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:32 PM   #14
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Pann, she can't access this forum. The funny thing is that most of what I write about her is very positive. It's been the last 2 months or so that have been real ____!

I think she started saying that because she thinks I should go to bed when she does. Often times at night I am on here answering posts or reading older posts. Right now I think it is a control issue.
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Old 10-07-2009, 09:33 PM   #15
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

I agree she doesn't know why, and there likely are some hormonal things going on. I am of the mind that you need to let her know in no uncertain terms that this will not be tolerated. You can understand where it is coming from and empathize, but let her know she will not be allowed to deal with it in this manner. I say a "come to Jesus" is in order as long as you are fairly certain that this is testing. I feel like it is, I think you would know if there were more at play here. Nip it in the bud.
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:02 PM   #16
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Wow sorry Lisa that you are having to go through this...I used to do this very frequently as a pre-teen, get out of the car before going home and run or running off from home but I was a victim of sexual abuse by my stepfather and after doctors confirmed it he'd spent time in jail with his pic in the paper and a sign in our yard and everything and when he got out she took him back, resulting in me and my sisters in a foster home for a good while (Ive since forgiven him and her and they are still together) but I didn't want to go home b/c sad to say when he first got home those things had been threatening to happen again and my mom NEVER would listen to me or believe me about anything even when there was proof. So hopefully there is nothing she's angry about that is serious.(Not saying there is, just giving you a reason why I used to take off) In what you've said so far sounds to me like testing. But anyways, I hope she will talk with you about it soon and things get better.
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:09 PM   #17
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

IDK. I don't want to be an alarmist, and you certainly know your daughter best, but I just don't know.
She was doing great in school. Fit in well, socialized, liked going there, etc. Wasn't there the first hint at noticing cute boys or something? Everything is normal and fine.
Then there is the porn thing. That alone (seeing it) could have thrown her for a loop, but a bigger concern of mine is that she heard about it at school, right? Was all new to her, but apparently there are some way less than nieve kids at school....and she has been involved with them enough to have been givin this information. I doubt they are just openly announcing it to everybody.
Now, suddenly and without explaination, she is ____ bent on NOT going to school and livid that you made her go.
Now, I'm not suggesting that A has done anything wrong or shameful or anything, but she may know kids that are. Kids she doesn't want to, may be afraid to, rat out. She may be badly frightened by what she is becomming aware of. They may be teasing her or humiliateing her in some way.
Middle schoolers are mean. It really is the worst.
As for the computer (forum) thing...she might be just grasping at straws to about...or maybe some of whatever is upsetting her is tied in with computers somehow. And you know about sexting, right?
Again, I don't want to make you stress any worse than you already are, but I have to be honest about what I think and feel.
No matter what, it is NOT ok for her to treat you like this. I just hope she spills whatever it is before it drives a wedge between you two.
Her mentioning her Dad in the middle of all this disturbs me, too. The fact that whatever it is, it brought him up in her mind. As you said, the way she referenced him made no sense.
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:37 PM   #18
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Quote:
Her mentioning her Dad in the middle of all this disturbs me, too.
I think that was meant to hurt.

The only thing that keeps coming up in my mind is that she somehow found out about the baby? Is it even remotely possible she overheard a discussion about it? Anything like that?

My gut still says rebellion/testing/hormones. Girls push HARD against mama (or mama figure).

After she calms down, I think I would sit her down, explain her behavior is not acceptable and will not be tolerated. Ask her straight up if there is anything she isn't telling you, why she thinks you don't care, etc. I think you will know if there is anything more wrong at that point. If you still feel like it is just rebellion, etc I say Come To Jesus.

Oh, and this is tough stuff!
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:16 PM   #19
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

I do think that the dad thing was meant to hurt me.

Blue, you make some valid points. I know that part of what she is dealing at with school has to do with peer stuff. She told me last week that she is in the "popular" crowd, but they are not very nice. But she said if she does not hang out with them she won't have friends.

Example: She had this friend from grade school that is tagging around the "popular" crowd. None of the kids [but A] likes this little girl. I feel bad for this girl as she is from a strict mormon home and is having a hard time fitting in. Anyway, one of the boys asked this girl out--but he plans to dump her after an hour and tell her that it was never real and that she is some geek. The other girls think this is a great idea and thinks it's funny. A is heartbroken. She wants to tell the other girl, but she does not want to become the target.

I know there is school things going on. I just don't understand the irrational anger that she is turning on me. I am not even sure she knows.
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:36 PM   #20
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

I think maybe she is directing her anger at you, possibly, simply because you are the safe bet. You will get mad, but you will never leave, never abandon. She cannot "get mad" at these girls but the whole situation is very stressful. If thats the case, maybe after tonight that pent up frustration will simmer down.
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:43 PM   #21
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Oh Lisa, I am so sorry you are having to deal with all this.
I don't get the off the wall anger, either. I am very glad, however, to hear that she is talking to you about some hard truths at school. So sad that she is being torn between her friend and "fitting in". I'm sure that is tearing her up inside...but since she is talking to you about it, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with this stuff she's pulling now.
I hope you can get to the bottom of it soon. Good luck.
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Old 10-08-2009, 07:42 AM   #22
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

There´s definitely something serious going on at school. I used to fake being sick when I was around this age so I wouldn´t have to go to school and be teased all day by those girls who bad mouthed me only because I was new and not speaking well their language. It is a HORRIBLE time and she certainly thinks you don´t understand her. Try to get her to talk, listen, be there for her etc, etc... I feel very badly for your daughter as I can relate and most of the time we do not tell our parents about it but instead rebel.
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Old 10-08-2009, 08:40 AM   #23
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Thinking about you today!
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Old 10-08-2009, 12:14 PM   #24
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Wow....Sorry you are going through this....Jr. High is the worst, and really hard on girls...Girls ARE mean. Its such a tough time in kids lives!!!

Is there something you guys can do together? Like go to a movie or even just go to lunch and have a mom and daughter day? my kids are younger than yours but i know when mine start acting out and everything its cause they want attention from me. And beings she has said things about you being on the forums and saying things about her dad maybe she jsut wants some attention from you. NOT saying you don't but i know myself sometimes when i think i'm doing things with them i'm preoccupied with everyday dealings, kwim? HUGE HUGS!!!!!!
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Old 10-08-2009, 07:19 PM   #25
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Hi-
I wonder if she's being bullied at school.
It could also be a bunch of different things that by themselves aren't so bad, but added up together becomes very stressful for a middle schooler. You sound like you're on top of things although her behavior is very frustrating. Like someone else suggested, she may be willing to have an ongoing conversation about things when she's feeling calmer. Go with your gut...
Let us know how you're both doing!

-Teresa
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Old 10-09-2009, 12:38 AM   #26
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Just lettin' you know I was wondering about you and your daughter...Hope today was a brighter day today!
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Old 10-09-2009, 02:52 AM   #27
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Okay, so she is staying another night at my parents tonight. My mom and I had planned on going to the movie screening that BB had told all of us about. So, my dad said he would watch her while mom and I had bonding time.

My mom took her last night and closed A in mom's bedroom. She then gave A an assignment. She had her right down her top 10 priorities for the next year, her top 10 frustrations. Along with that she had to say why they were important to her or why things frusterated her.

Mom discovered that the reason that A does not want to go to schools on Tuesdays is because almost all her classes assign homework on Mondays that are due on Tuesdays. But because of dance, she is not getting it done and in on time. This is creating some big stressors. My mom asked her why she would not just tell me that. A said she did not want me to be disappointed. My mom said, "Well A, your mom is a student. She understands. She could probably help you brainstorm solutions to how you can do both."

Mom said on A's list, I was her number 1 priority, but her number 8 frustration.

Mom also said that it is not all school that is stressing her out. My daughter is going through her own grieving process. A is terrified that my sister's sex offender is going to do something to my niece. A, a victim of her own father, is really owning this and is very, very scared for B. Next, A is very angry, sad, and stressed that my niece and nephew is moving. She also understands that our family will never be the same. That since BIL cannot be around her, that we are not very likely to experience the same Christmas's. To put this in context, for the last 10 years, no matter what, we all stay at my parents house Christmas eve. The kids then wake up Christmas morning together and start searching for the Santa presents. A knows this is going to change and she is experiencing huge anxiety.

My mom explained to her that she is not alone in feeling that. That Nana feels that way too, and it's okay to be sad. But that we have to realize that things can never stay the same. That is just life. And that no matter what, Nana would make sure that A would see B & B as often as possible.

I think that A is experiencing anxiety and stress. She does not know how to deal with this at all. She told my mom that she felt like she could not talk to me about it. A feels that I hurt too much and that when she tries to talk to me about the BIL situation, that it upsets me. A is ashamed that this monster is her "uncle" now. She is afraid people are going to find out and not want to be friends with her.

So, what happened was a mixture of school and home---the reality is that it all exploded.

I am glad she is staying tonight with my mom so that I can really think about what I want to say to her. I am still angry at her, but I hurt for her too.

On another note, that Clive Owen movie was GREAT. I saw so many pieces of myself as a single parent, that it was not even funny. I also saw pieces of A in the oldest boys character.
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Old 10-09-2009, 03:03 AM   #28
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Law Student Lisa View Post
Example: She had this friend from grade school that is tagging around the "popular" crowd. None of the kids [but A] likes this little girl. I feel bad for this girl as she is from a strict mormon home and is having a hard time fitting in. Anyway, one of the boys asked this girl out--but he plans to dump her after an hour and tell her that it was never real and that she is some geek. The other girls think this is a great idea and thinks it's funny. A is heartbroken. She wants to tell the other girl, but she does not want to become the target.
Do you think it's possible the things she's saying aren't about this other girl at all, but about her?

That she doesn't want to admit it, but that she's the one really being picked on?

And directing her anger at you is just as Sara said - she's unleashing it in the safest way she knows how. Toward the one person she knows will never turn her back on her. Even though she doesn't think you understand, and maybe even doesn't think you care, she knows you'll always be there. She can run away, but she knows you'll be there when she gets back. She can tell you she hates you a hundred times, but she knows you will never stop loving her.

As for dealing with it in the heat of the moment, fighting and arguing will only make it worse. You have to look at it like you're dealing with a toddler. A toddler with hormones. Only you do have the benefit of them having a slightly larger vocabulary and a minimally greater comprehension level.

So let her throw her tantrums and just ignore them. Walk away like you would a toddler. I don't know what kind of neighborhood you live in, or how far you think she'd go if you just let her run, but I'd even consider not chasing her. She's going to get hungry sometime.

And then try to talk to her when she's rational. She does get there, because you've at least managed to get a little bit out of her about what's been bothering her.

Now if you can never get through to her when she's calm, and she continues to act out, and counseling isn't helping, you can do what my mom did to me... she drove me to a girl's home and parked out front and told me I was going to live there if I didn't get myself under control. But you have to mean it. My mom didn't mean it, she was weak, and I knew it. So it didn't work with me. But you mean business, so I'd go into detail about what the place is, what they do, what kinds of kids go there... set an ultimatum. Either she lets you help her through whatever's bothering her and starts respecting you at least enough not to beat the ____ out of you and keep running away, or she has to go somewhere else because the situation as it is isn't safe for either of you.

ETA: I was posting at the same time as you were. That's a brilliant idea that your mom had. I'm going to file that away to bring out a few years down the road. I will keep A (and you) in my prayers.
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:00 AM   #29
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

OH Lisa reading your post has given me alot of good ideas with my situation with my teen Im going to do them this weekend thanks. Also I hope your situationwith your daughter gets better soon. It already sounds like its on the right track. HUGS
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Old 10-09-2009, 10:21 AM   #30
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

I am so sad for A and for you, so mad at your sister, and so impressed with your Mom!
I'm glad you got through the "WTH!" part of this. I hope you can all come to terms (or find a way to manage that gives you some peace) with the causes.
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Old 10-09-2009, 07:18 PM   #31
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Way to go Momma! My heart aches for A. The "loss" of family has been a big issue for mine just on a different lvel because of their ages. Hope A feels better and glad you enjoyed the movie.
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Old 10-09-2009, 09:01 PM   #32
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Lisa, so glad you've gotten to the bottom of it. Kudos to your mom!!!! I am impressed and see where you get the good head on your shoulders!

Let us know how things go.
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Old 10-11-2009, 08:47 PM   #33
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Im glad you have a strong mother to help you there, you & A are very lucky.

Teen and Attitude just go hand to hand. She is on her next milestone on how to react to her personal likes and dislikes...
In the physical the brain will be utilizing more area, and her understanding of things will be more to understanding the relationship as a whole, she know understands the connection with BIL and her dignity and associating. How we are all connected.

Within the first year of middle school my kids have gone through the attitude and well it never stops but how they express and react get better.

Me:Why did you do that?
My Kids: cause I can
Me: Well Duh, you just figured that out. Good, then you know why we dont.
That open up dialog and / or writing to ... the
answers and Ive gotten multiple answers at any given time.

You can reach and side for the God Fearing, integrity /andor Social Commitment etc...
[or Because I said so...hahahha that works too for some hahaha]
But it is a place to have that emotional anchor.

Just some food for thought to help jump start the creative juices flowing.



Im glad to see y'all are going in a positive directio.
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Old 10-12-2009, 02:44 PM   #34
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Default Re: AGH, I have had it

Your Mom is a genius..if she isn't a psychologist, she should be one.
WTG getting your daughter to open the lines of communication!
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